Topic: Lights work via control box, motor doesn't!

[Markymark]

Hello all, I recently joined after buying a C5 that had been in a barn for a number of years.  It was pedal power only when I bought it, but had a couple of thick wires in the C5 bodyshell which connected straight to the motor.  The go switch was blown and therefore had been disconnected at some point, but upon connecting a battery to the motor it worked fine, albeit with the additional use of the light switch (which had already been disconnected from the light circuit) to switch the motor on or off.  This worked fine for a couple of weeks and we took it to Santa Pod for the retro show where it got pretty much everyone there commenting on how they'd never seen a C5 before.  It got a few more comments when my son managed to roll it, but that's not my reason for writing!  After a few weeks the light switch blew, so I am just wondering if anyone knows a source to buy a suitable go switch, ideally to be put in the correct location?

I have another issue as well if anyone could help - I bought a leisure battery wiring kit and fitted it, and for the first time in my ownership the lights now work.  Unfortunately after returning the motor wiring to the correct (I think!) positions (Black wire to X4 and red wire to X3) and then holding the go switch wires together (yellow and grey, located on the handlebars) I get nothing  The pod doesn't light up either, which may or may not be related.

I did a bit of searching on this site and found  http://c5alive.co.uk/forum/index.php?PHPSESSID=8a80e1feaa7f248ea27afacf053b47fa&topic=1320.0 I'd never used a voltmeter before but got a 12.8 reading from the battery so guess my voltmeter is roughly working!  I therefore checked a reading at R1 in the control pod and got a varying reading from 0.2 to 1.8 (from memory).  The reading the other/leaving side of R1 was 0.3, so would this suggest what is faulty?  I'm just wondering if I need to try bypassing the pod as the next daunting step.  As you have probably guessed I know nothing about electrics but would really like to get the C5 motor working safely (with thermal cutout) so I can continue getting about in it!  Any guidance would be most gratefully received!  Thanks

[PLOD11]

Hi there ...

Check your volts around D4 and D1 also what volts you have on either side of the fuses.

Also have you got a connection to X5 ?

You should have 12 volts on at least one side of R1 to start with.

Radiomarty offers a repair /exchange service for the control box if you get stuck.


Where are you located ??



John
PLOD11

[ScubaChris]

When you say you used the light switch to control the on/off function of the motor, I assume you mean that you connected it to the yellow & grey wires that normally go to the button on the left handlebar? Small switches like this must never be used directly in-line with the battery leads as they simply won't be able to handle the large current flowing to the motor. The little microswitch on the handlebar switches the motor current on and off indirectly (via a relay in the control box). It's easy to test if that little switch is at fault by using a continuity tester.

C.

[Markymark]

Thank you both for the replies.  John - I've just tested the volts (with the lights on, in case it makes a difference) and got: Battery - 12.44V, D4 - 12.40V and 12.37V far side, D1 I couldn't find  , 1 amp fuse - 12.36V either side, 5 amp fuse - 12.3V5 either side.

These were all constant readings, but a weird thing happens with the reading of R1, the reading fluctuates wildly between 1.0V and 8.2V with the reading changing every half second or so! However it read 1.6V on the far side of it.  I'm guessing those readings are not a good sign    I have the thin brown wire from the Leisure Battery wiring connected to X5 ok, and am from the outskirts of Bedford (which has a fantastic cycle track called Route 51 which must have been made with the C5 in mind!)  Would the readings suggest I need to start enquiring about a replacement control box?!  And if the pod is also broken would this prevent the motor from working even after a control box swap?  Thanks!

Scuba Chris: I used the light switch to control the on/off function of the motor, by adding some car radio wiring to either side of the light switch then putting it on the end of one of the motor wires running to/from the battery.  I think I learnt my lesson with that idea when the switch broke in the on position with a worried eight year old on it, luckily going round an empty park in circles, for some time....   The button/switch that was under the left handlebar was definitely already broke as it had a bit fall out of it upon examination.  That's one bit that I didn't break myself

[PLOD11]

Hi there

D1 is at the top between x3 and x4,
You seem to have 12 volts in the right places, but the readings on R1 are odd, i would have thought that with +12v on both sides of D4 you would have 12 v on one side of R1 as these are linked on the pcb.

The POD may well be ok, but with out the 12 volts going across R1 to the 5v regulator (IC1)the POD wont light up.

Every thing in the Control box is fixable, depends if you want to have a go at it yourself, or to save the time and effort go for an exchange unit from  Radiomarty, you can email him for details of his services  radiomarty@fsmail.net

John

PLOD11

[Markymark]

Thanks for your help with this, will check again then consider the options.  Much appreciated!

[Markymark]

Got back from Holiday and decided to rip the C5 apart in an attempt to establish why the motor wasn't working.  Upon taking the PCB out of the control box and turning it over I saw a loose bit of copper ribbon coming from the 'channel' that links R1 to X3.  So I'm guessing (with assistance from earlier enquiries  ) that's the reason for the wild readings from R1 and the reason for the motor not working?  Thanks for earlier help, just wondering if a carefully applied blob of solder to join the two pieces of copper ribbon together is all that's required, and will it make a difference that the green coating from the PCB is missing over the hopefully repaired section?  Thanks in advance to anyone who can advise 

[Lancealot]

Hi once you have fixed the control box and everything looks ok you may just want to go over the other joints.
The control box is fairly weather proof generally but if you are worried you can allways cover the soldered area with a bit of clear varnish or nail polish.

hope this helps

Lance

[PLOD11]

Repairing the track should do it, green coating is just a laquer thats applied when the PCB is made.

Give it a go !!   

[Markymark]

Thank you both very much, will dig out the soldering iron tomorrow 

[Markymark]

I had a go with the soldering iron and managed to fix the break, and could see 12V getting to R1 but not the other side of it.  As I wasn't confident with soldering skills (or getting a replacement resistor) I bought a spare working board and have just installed that.  For the first time in my ownership the pod now lights up, full on battery side and two orange led's on each side of the left side LED's.  Unfortunately that's about it, as when pressing the replacement go switch I bought (which I think was a motor switch rather than a horn switch as it had yellow and grey wires on it) it just lights up the two orange LED's as before plus the next green LED.  There is no noise or movement from the motor, which I've tested off the battery direct so know that the motor works.

Are there any known faults that this could be down to, or any further checks that I could make to try to narrow down the source of the problem?

Any advice would be gratefully received, as I'm running out of ideas and have tried searching on here for similar issues to no avail. 

Thanks!

[PLOD11]

Initial check would be to check you if you have 12 volts on the leads to the motor when you press the switch ?

You are getting the correct indications on the POD, i know its a silly question, but are all the cables put back in same place they came off ? 

I did this once and had connected one cable wrongly ..

Have you a pic of the board with all the cables connected to it ?

I am sure there will be some others who will be along shortly with stuff to check, we can get it going.

The old Control board is repairable so hang on to it and we can get it sorted at a later date for you.

[Markymark]

Thanks for suggestion, I put the voltmeter red lead on the red motor connection (where it joins motor housing) and the black voltmeter lead on X1 and it reads 12v regardless of whether the go switch is pressed or not!  I then put the red voltmeter lead on X3 and then X4 (red motor lead and black motor lead respectively) and they both read 12v regardless of whether go switch is pressed or not! I therefore wired the leads direct to the battery and the motor runs fine (just to make sure I hadn't damaged motor since it last worked).

I've added a photo here: http://flic.kr/p/aeZLRX, (it was the right way up but the flickr website puts it upside down)  >: to me the wiring looks the same as one I found at http://c5alive.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=1390.0

I finally tested the yellow lead of the go switch and it has 12 volts and when the button is pressed the grey lead carries out 12v, and the voltage arrives OK on the grey lead on X8 of the control board.

I'm hoping it's a simple case of me not wiring something up properly! Thanks in advance for any advice 

[PLOD11]

All looks fine from the pic, could be the relay, but not sure at this stage.

I will take some readings on mine over the next couple of days and let you know   

[radiomarty]

Hi Just noticed this post - hope I can be of some help.Assuming your new control box is ok and your pod seems to be giving the correct indication I would look into the red wiring harness from pod to control box - try wiggling it with the motor button pressed - ps you commented that you had 12v reading at the motor regardless of the 'go' button being pressed - this cannot be because it would cause your motor to run permanently !!!.Keep us posted and if all else fails stick it in the back of your car and pop over i'm only a half an hour from Bedford  and would be happy to take a look at it for you:)